Artist and Curator Ewen Chardronnet discusses with art historian Fabrice Lapelletrie their ongoing research around Frank Malina and his circles of friends and collaborators both in Pasadena around the work of the ‘suicide club” headed by Malina with Jack Parsons, Ed Foreman. Hu Hse Tsien whose work led to the first successful American high altitude rockets, the founding of NASA JPL and Aerojet Gen Corporation. Malina then became known as a pioneer of kinetic art in Paris in the 1950s and 60s. Chardronnet discusses his ongoing research which has included visiting many of the foundational sites of American rocketry. Lapelletrie discusses the context of the birth of kinetic art in Paris in the 195os.